>> PRESS FREEDOM IS AT A 25-YEAR LOW ACCORDING TO REPORTERS WITHOUT BORDERS.

IN THE ONGOING BATTLE WITH THE WHITE HOUSE, JOURNALISTS WERE BANNED FROM AIR FORCE ONE, THEY FACE INCREASINGLY HOSTILE ENVIRONMENTS.

"WASHINGTON POST" JOURNALIST JASON RIZAON WAS ABDUCTED AND TALKS ABOUT THE PRESS FREEDOM AROUND THE WORLD.

>> THIS JANUARY, IT'S BEEN TEN YEARS SINCE YOU WERE FREED FROM AN IRANIAN PRISON WHERE YOU SPENT 544 DAYS AFTER --WHEN YOU WERE WORKING FOR "THE WASHINGTON POST" AND YOU STILL ARE.

YOU'VE MADE ADVOCATING FOR THE SAFETY AND FREEDOM OF JOURNALISTS PART OF YOUR LIFE'S MISSION AND WORK.

I WONDER, WHEN YOU LOOK ACROSS THE LANDSCAPE, DOMESTICALLY H INTERNATIONALLY, WHAT DO YOU SEE WHEN IT COMES TO HOW JOURNALISTS ARE TREATED AND HOW DIFFICULT THE JOB IS BECOMING?

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME BACK.

WHEN I FIRST CAME BACK FROM THE EXPERIENCE, AND DECIDED TO STAY IN JOURNALISM, IT WASN'T TO REPORT ON CASES OF JOURNALISTS UNDER ATTACK, ATTACKS ON THE FREE PRESS BUT I SAW SO MANY IN DIFFERENT PLACES, REPORTED AS ONE-OFFS.

JOURNALIST ABDUCTED OR ARRESTED IN MYANMAR, ANOTHER MURDERED IN SLOVAKIA.

BUT AS YOU LOOKED AT CASES AS PART OF LARGER TRENDS IN COUNTRIES ALREADY AUTOCRACIES OR SLIDING DOWN AN AUTHORITARIAN PATH, IT BECAME CLEAR THAT LOTS OF GOVERNMENTS WERE MIMICKING EACH OTHER'S TREATMENT OF THE PRESS.

I WISH I COULD SAY MY REPORTING ON THESE CASES AND TRENDS HAS MADE A DIFFERENCE, BUT IT'S ONLY GOTTEN WORSE.

>> THREE YEARS AFTER OCTOBER 7, 2023, AND THAT PARTICULAR CONFLICT, THE NUMBER OF MEDIA WORKERS KILLED HAS SURPASSED 247 AND COUNTING.

THAT'S A BIG NUMBER, BUT WHAT IS THE STORY THAT NUMBER DOESN'T TELL?

>> I THINK FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVE LOST ALMOST ALL WINDOWS INTO GAZA.

SIMILAR SITUATION IN IRAN AND OTHER PLACES IN THE WORLD, BUT THE EXTREME VACUUM WE ARE OPERATING IN WHEN IT COMES TO REPORTING ON GAZA IS MAKING IT VERY DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND IN A FULSOME WAY WHAT THE UNITED STATES' ROLE WAS THERE AND SHOULD BE OR SHOULDN'T BE.

WHAT SORT OF INJUSTICES AND POTENTIAL CRIMES ARE BEING PERPETRATED AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF GAZA BY ISRAELI ATTACKS.

AND IT MAKES IT REALLY DIFFICULT FOR US TO HAVE AN HONEST CONVERSATION ABOUT HOW TO LESSEN THE DEVASTATION, SUPPORT THE RECONSTRUCTION, AND WHAT THINGS WILL LOOK LIKE MOVING FORWARD.

AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE FREEDOM OF THE PRESS AND MEDIA TO OPERATE IN THESE PLACES IS SO FUNDAMENTAL TO OUR ABILITY TO PROPERLY UNDERSTAND.

AND WE'VE BEEN ROBBED OF THAT IN THIS SITUATION.

THE NUMBER OF MEDIA WORKERS KILLED THERE IN THE HUNDREDS GOES FAR BEYOND ANY OTHER CONFLICT WE'VE EVER DOCUMENTED BEFORE.

AND THE TRUTH IS, EVEN BEFORE OCTOBER 7th, THERE WAS THE KILLING OF PALESTINIAN AMERICAN JOURNALIST, WHICH WE KNOW WAS DONE BY THE IBF, WHICH WE KNOW THROUGH VARIOUS INVESTIGATIONS WAS AN TARGETED KILLING OF A JOURNALIST WHO WAS AN AMERICAN CITIZEN AND THERE'S BEEN NO ACCOUNTABILITY IN THAT CASE.

HOW CAN WE EXPECT ACCOUNTABILITY IN THE CASES OF SO MANY OTHERS WHEN EVEN A U. S. CITIZEN'S DEATH IS NOT ACCOUNTED FOR.

>> AND IBF CHIEF SPOKESMAN SAID ABOUT THAT KILLING, WE'RE VERY SORRY OF THE DEATH IN ISRAEL.

WE VALUE OUR DEMOCRACY AND IN DEMOCRACY WE SEE HIGH VALUE IN JOURNALISM AND A FREE PRESS.

WE WANT JOURNALISTS TO FEEL SAFE IN ISRAEL, ESPECIALLY IN WAR TIME, EVEN IF THEY CRITICIZE US.

THIS WAS A WHILE BACK.

YOU'RE REMINDING PEOPLE OF YOUR COLLEAGUE, JAMAL KHASHOGGI, AND HIS MANNER OF DEATH AT THE DIRECTION OF WHAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE ONE OF OUR CLOSEST ALLIES.

>> TWO OF OUR CLOSEST ALLIES, ISRAEL AND SAUDI ARABIA.

AND I THINK THE MESSAGE THESE KILLINGS SEND TO OTHER LEADERS, FRIEND AND FOE ALIKE, YOU CAN KILL A JOURNALIST, YOU CAN KILL AN AMERICAN JOURNALIST, A JOURNALIST WORKING FOR AMERICAN MEDIA.

YOU CAN ABDUCT THEM, TAKE THEM HOSTAGE AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY A PRICE FOR IT.

I THINK THAT'S THE WRONG MESSAGE TO SEND >> THIS IS SOMETHING THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, THE NETANYAHU ADMINISTRATION TALKS ABOUT, TRYING TO INCREASE ACCESS FOR JOURNALISTS.

BECAUSE THE ISRAELI POSITION IS IT'S SAFETY AND SECURITY, YOU DO THIS YOU'RE ON YOUR OWN AND I CAN'T PROTECT YOU.

YOU MIGHT BE IN HARM'S WAY.

>> YOU KNOW, IT RESONATES WITH ME VERY CLEARLY.

I CAN REMEMBER TIMES WHEN I WAS REPORTING INSIDE OF IRAN, WITH FULL PERMISSION AND TRANSPARENCY, AND BEING TOLD BY IRANIAN AUTHORITIES, YOU SHOULD STOP REPORTING FOR A WHILE AND LEAVE THE COUNTRY, WE CAN'T GUARANTEE YOUR SAFETY AND SECURITY.

WE'RE NOT THREATENING YOU BUT THIS CAN BE A DANGEROUS AND VOLATILE PLACE.

IT'S A SIMILAR ATTITUDE, IDEA IS INTIMIDATE PEOPLE INTO SILENCE.

AND WHEN THEY'RE NOT WILLING TO BE SILENCED, OBSCURE THE REALITIES ON THE GROUND IN OTHER WAYS.

AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, IT'S AN IMPORTANT CONVERSATION TO HAVE WITHIN THE MEDIA, THE RISKS POSED TO JOURNALISTS ARE DIFFERENT THAN THEY WERE TEN YEARS AGO WHEN I WAS ABDUCTED.

THE NUMBER OF INSTANCES, ACTS OF VIOLENCE, USE OF HEAVY FIREPOWER AGAINST JOURNALISTS, ABDUCTIONS, LAW FARE, ALL HAVE INCREASED IMMEASURABLY.

NEWS ORGANIZATIONS HAVE TO DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE WILLING TO TAKE THOSE RISKS TO PUT PEOPLE ON THE GROUND, BUT THE CALCULATIONS HAVE TO BE DIFFERENT THAN THEY WERE BEFORE BECAUSE IT'S A MUCH RISKIER BUSINESS.

THAT SMACKS TO ME AS KIND OF AN EXCUSE BY THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT TO KEEP PEOPLE OUT, AND ALSO TO FURTHER ABSOLVE THEMSELVES OF RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE DEATHS OF THESE JOURNALISTS.

>> THE COMMITTEE TO PROTECT JOURNALISTS SAYS MORE JOURNALISTS DIED IN 2025 THAN ANY YEAR IN THE THREE DECADES THEY'VE BEEN KEEPING TRACK.

YOU ARE ON SOMETHING CALLED THE FREEDOM DESK AT "THE WASHINGTON POST. "

WHAT IS IT AND WHY DOES "THE WASHINGTON POST" DO IT?

>> PART OF WHAT I TRIED TO DO THROUGH PRESS FREEDOM INITIATIVES IS TRY TO EMPOWER EXILED JOURNALISTS.

PEOPLE WORKING IN COUNTRIES LIKE IRAN, GAZA, CHINA, RUSSIA, INDIA, WHERE IT'S NO LONGER HOSPITABLE TO BE A JOURNALIST ON THE GROUND.

THESE ARE PEOPLE WITH DEEP INSIGHT, CONTACTS, EXPERIENCE.

LET THEM HELP US TELL THE STORY OF THEIR HOMELANDS, RATHER THAN RELYING ON SECONDHAND ACCOUNTS OR PARACHUTING PEOPLE IN FOR BRIEF PERIODS OF REPORTING TIME.

WE PUT OUT A NEWSLETTER A COUPLE TIMES A WEEK TO HIGHLIGHT THE CASES.

AND THEN A PODCAST THAT'S CONVERSATIONS WITH PEOPLE ON THE FRONT LINES OF THE FIGHT FOR FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION.

WE'LL HAVE AN EPISODE COMING UP WITH NOBEL LAUREATE AND MANY OTHERS, GERSHWITZ WAS ON IT.

TRYING TO RAISE THE LEVEL TO PUBLIC CONSCIOUSNESS.

>> HE CAME OUT WITH A BOOK RECENTLY.

A "WALL STREET JOURNAL" CORRESPOND, ARRESTED IN RUSSIA IN MARCH OF 2023 UNDER ESPIONAGE CHARGES AND FREED AFTER 491 DAYS I THINK IN DETENTION THERE, PART OF A PRISONER EXCHANGE.

BUT I WONDER, YOU HAVE THIS CONVERSATION WITH HIM.

YOU TWO HAVE A VERY UNIQUE OVERLAP OF LIFE EXPERIENCE.

WHAT SIMILARITIES DID YOU SEE IN HIS STORY?

WHAT WAS SO DIFFERENT?

>> THERE WERE SO MANY SIMILARITIES IN THE WINDOW DRESSING OF OUR CASES.

RIGHT?

WE ARE ABDUCTED, TOLD WE'RE ACCUSED OF ESPIONAGE, THROWN INTO ISOLATION IMPRISONED.

SO MANY ASPECTS OF CONFINEMENT AND THE QUESTIONS THAT ONE HAS WHEN THEY ARE VERY SUDDENLY THRUST INTO AN EXPERIENCE LIKE THAT, CUT OFF FROM THE REST OF THE WORLD, WAS SO SIMILAR TO MY OWN.

WHAT WAS REALLY DIFFERENT THOUGH WAS EVAN SEEMED TO HAVE A VERY CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT WAS HAPPENING.

HE WAS FODDER FOR A POTENTIAL PRISONER SWAP.

IN MY CASE, IT TOOK MANY MONTHS FOR THAT TO BECOME CLEAR TO ME.

PART OF THAT, IN THE DECADE IN BETWEEN, THERE ARE SO MANY OF THESE CASES.

IRAN DOES IT, RUSSIA DOES IT, CHINA DOES IT, VENEZUELA DOES IT, SO MANY DOING IT TO EXERT PRESSURE OVER U. S. WITH A JOURNALIST, TAKE SOMEONE OF PERCEIVED HIGH VALUE, THAT WILL BE OF INTEREST TO THE U. S. GOVERNMENT IN A HOSTAGE TRADE BECAUSE THERE'S SO MUCH PUBLIC OUTCRY, BUT ALSO HAS A CHILLING EFFECT ON THE JOURNALISTS ON THE GROUND.

IF WE CAN DO THIS TO THE CORRESPONDENT OF THE "WASHINGTON POST" OR THE "WALL STREET JOURNAL," WE CAN DO IT TO THE JOURNALIST FOR THE LOCAL PAPER.

>> THEY'RE USING THE COUNTRY'S DISINFORMATION LAW TO DETAIN JOURNALISTS.

IS THAT A MODEL THAT CAN BE REPLICATED OR SOMETHING THEY'RE LOOKING AT THE UNITED STATES FOR AS A TEMPLATE?

>> WE HAVE TO REMEMBER THIS IDEA OF FAKE NEWS DID NOT START WITH DONALD TRUMP.

BUT HE DEFINITELY GAVE IT A LOT OF OXYGEN IN OUR NATIONAL CONVERSATION.

WHEN YOU HEAR SOMEONE IN A LEADERSHIP POSITION TALKING ABOUT FAKE NEWS, ACCUSING A REPORT OF BEING FAKE NEWS, YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER, THIS IS JUST SHORTHAND FOR COVERAGE OF ME AND MY CRONIES THAT I DON'T LIKE, RIGHT?

THE EXPOSING OF INFORMATION OF WRONGDOINGS THAT WE WOULD RATHER KEEP SUPPRESSED.

THESE KIND OF LAWS LIKE THE ONE IN TURKIYE ARE GAINING A LOT OF TRACTION IN COUNTRIES AROUND THE WORLD.

DEALT WITH A LOT OF SIMILAR ACCUSATIONS.

THEY HAD LAWS ON THE BOOKS IN THE PHILIPPINES AROUND THAT, SO TRIED TO GET HER ON TAX EVASION AND OTHER TYPES OF FINANCIAL CHARGES.

THE IDEA IS TO --TO COMMIT WHAT WE CALL LAW FARE AGAINST THESE INDIVIDUALS.

PUT THEM ON FRIVOLOUS TRIALS THAT EITHER BANKRUPT THEM OR TAKE UP SO MUCH OF THEIR TIME THEY'RE UNABLE TO CONTINUE TO REPORT.

OR FRANKLY GET TIRED OF DOING IT.

WE'VE SEEN IT HAPPEN IN THE UNITED STATES.

>> AND JUST RECENTLY, HAD PRESIDENT BE ABLE TO KICK CNN AND MSNOW OUT OF THE PRESS POOL.

>> THESE ARE THINGS WE NEED TO TAKE VERY SERIOUSLY.

THERE'S A REASON THAT THE FREEDOM OF THE PRESS IS INSHRINED IN THE BILL OF RIGHTS AS LITERALLY THE FIRST AMENDMENT TO WHAT WAS ALREADY A STRONG DOCTRINE.

AND I THINK WE HAVE TO TAKE ANY ONE OF THESE THREATS TO OUR ABILITY TO COVER THE WHITE HOUSE OR ANYWHERE ELSE VERY SERIOUSLY.

THAT BEING SAID, THESE THREATS ARE STILL NOWHERE NEAR THE LEVEL OF WHAT PEOPLE ARE EXPERIENCING IN RUSSIA, CHINA, IRAN, SO MANY OTHER PLACES AROUND THE WORLD.

>> YOUR COLLEAGUE HANNAH'S DEVICES WERE SEIZED BY THE FBI, EVEN THOUGH SHE WAS NOT THE ACTUAL TARGET.

REFRESH US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED IN THAT CASE.

WHAT DID THE ADMINISTRATION SAY ABOUT IT?

AND THEN WHAT EFFECT IT MIGHT HAVE.

BECAUSE I LOOK AT THIS, SAY THIS IS A REPORTER FROM ONE OF THE MOST POWERFUL PRESS ORGANIZATIONS IN AMERICA.

>> YOU KNOW, THE IDEA BEING EARLY THIS YEAR, SHE AND OTHERS WERE WORKING ON A SERIES OF STORIES ABOUT WHISTLEBLOWERS IN THE GOVERNMENT.

THE FBI SHOWED UP AT HER HOUSE, SEIZED HER DEVICES, MADE IT CLEAR TO HER SHE WAS NOT THE SUBJECT OF THE INVESTIGATION, SOME OF HER SOURCES WERE.

AND YOU KNOW, THE LEGAL DISPUTE IS ONGOING.

SO I THINK THIS NOTION THAT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT CAN INTERVENE ON THE WORKINGS OF THE FREE PRESS IS SOMETHING THAT NO AMERICAN SHOULD ABIDE BY SILENTLY.

IT'S AN INTEGRAL PART OF WHAT IT MEANS TO BE A DEMOCRACY, THE ABILITY OF NEWS ORGANIZATIONS TO REPORT, TO PROTECT THEIR SOURCES IN THE ATTEMPT TO HOLD POWER TO ACCOUNT.

THIS IS A CLEAR EXAMPLE OF THAT.

AND IF THEY DO IT ONCE, THERE'S NO STOPPING THEM DOING IT AGAIN.

>> WHAT DO YOU SEE AS THE COST OF DECREASED JOURNALISM PRACTICED IN ALL THESE DIFFERENT PLACES AROUND THE WORLD?

INCLUDING PERHAPS THE UNITED STATES.

>> THE FIRST PIECE OF IT IS --IT BECOMES MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT TO HOLD POWER TO ACCOUNT WHEN THERE AREN'T JOURNALISTS THERE TO COVER THE GOINGS ON OF A STATE AND SOCIETY.

SECOND PIECE IS REALLY THE HUMAN UNDERSTANDING PART.

I WENT TO IRAN WITH THE BASIC PREMISE THAT THIS COUNTRY THAT I HAPPEN TO HAVE FAMILY ROOTS IN, MY FATHER WAS FROM IRAN, MY MOM CAME FROM THE MIDWEST.

I HAD GROWN UP IN A PERIOD OF TIME THAT ENMITY BETWEEN THE TWO COUNTRIES WAS SO SEVERE IT SEEMED ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE FOR AMERICANS TO TRY AND UNDERSTAND THE POINTS OF VIEW OF ORDINARY IRANIANS.

AS A STAND-IN FOR THE EXPERIENCE, LIVED EXPERIENCE OF IRANIAN PEOPLE, ALL WE HAD WERE PROCLAMATIONS OF THE CLERICAL LEADERSHIP OF THAT COUNTRY.

I BELIEVED WE COULD GO DEEPER AND EXPLAIN WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE A PERSON ON THE GROUND IN THAT COUNTRY UNDER THE YOKE OF A REPRESSIVE SYSTEM, AND ALSO HEAVILY IMPACTED BY AN AGGRESSIVE FOREIGN POLICY FROM THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

AND I THINK WE DID THAT.

I THINK OTHERS HAVE DONE THAT.

AND IT'S REALLY SAD TO ME THAT SINCE MY OWN ARREST, WE'VE LOST SO MANY OF THAT ACCESS.

TO ME THAT'S A VERY KIND OF ILLUMINATING EXAMPLE OF WHAT WE LOSE.

WE NEED THAT ABILITY TO UNDERSTAND THE HUMAN EXPERIENCE OF PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WORLD TO BE INFORMED ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS OVER THERE AND RIGHT HERE.

RIGHT?

THE IDEA OF JOURNALISM, THE IMPORTANCE OF JOURNALISM, IS TO HELP KEEP AN ELECTORATE INFORMED, RIGHT?

TO MAKE WISE CHOICES.

IF WE'RE NOT ABLE TO DO THAT IN PLACES FAR AND WIDE, WE CAN'T CLAIM TO BE INFORMED PEOPLE.

>> JASON REZAIAN, THANKS FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANKS HARI.